{"id":51020,"date":"2003-04-27T12:46:30","date_gmt":"2003-04-27T12:46:30","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.soulhuntre.com\/items\/date\/2003\/04\/27\/lets-talk-about-sex-porn\/"},"modified":"2003-04-27T12:46:30","modified_gmt":"2003-04-27T12:46:30","slug":"lets-talk-about-sex-porn-2","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"http:\/\/legacyiamsenseiken.local\/2003\/04\/27\/lets-talk-about-sex-porn-2\/","title":{"rendered":"Let\u2019s talk about sex (porn)\u2026"},"content":{"rendered":"<table cellSpacing=\"0\" cellPadding=\"1\" bgColor=\"#000000\" border=\"1\">\n<tbody>\n<tr>\n<td vAlign=\"center\" align=\"middle\"><a href=\"\/archives\/media\/1972_l2.ascx\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" height=\"125\" src=\"\/archives\/media\/1972_l2-thumb.jpg\" width=\"125\" border=\"0\"><\/a><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<tr>\n<td vAlign=\"center\" align=\"middle\" height=\"20\">hot stuff<\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/tbody>\n<\/table>\n<p>I&#8217;ve been meaning to post about pornography here for a while, but it looks like I&#8217;ll be busy for the next week so I am going to simply frame the debate and leave you with some resources. There is a lot of material here to present, and if you want to follow along with it you will find a lot of homework if you decide to do it. Just follow along and read the references you want to&#8230; no big deal. <\/p>\n<p><b>Notes:<\/b><\/p>\n<ul>\n<li>I am looking into enabling the comments system here. In the meantime as an experiment you can <a href=\"http:\/\/www.quicktopic.com\/21\/H\/GX298g6nen2MV\">Discuss this post @ Quicktopic<\/a>.\n<li>With any luck at all it seems lesbianism will become universal specifically so <a href=\"http:\/\/www.msmagazine.com\/ubb\/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=14;t=002103;p=2#000035\">guys like me will no longer exist or something<\/a>. Maybe you can tell me what it&#8217;s all about \ud83d\ude42 <\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<p><b>My stance can be summed up into a few short points anyway:<\/b><\/p>\n<ul>\n<li>Porn, like all forms of speech, has things you might like and things you will hate. They things you hate are a totally different issue from things that should be illegal.\n<li>Porn and feminism are compatible. The core of feminism is that women have the right to decide what they do with their body&#8230; porn counts.\n<li>Porn, like all large industries, has examples of abusive practices and bad eggs in its midst. This does not make every film an example of rape or force. <\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<p><b>Relaxation to start with:<\/b><\/p>\n<blockquote>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/drew.corrupt.net\/lp\/index.html\">drew##^# BLOCK STRUCTURE PORN!@<\/a> &#8211; I have this here for two reasons. First because it&#8217;s funny. Second to give you an example of something that I am sure extreme anti-porn feminists will still think is a tool of the patriarchy.<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<p><!--more--><\/p>\n<p><b>Media debate about porn, bias and your basic sensationalism:<\/b><\/p>\n<blockquote>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/us.imdb.com\/Title?0322500\">Hardcore (2001) (TV)<\/a> &#8211; this was a documentary that was sort of intended to be watched as if it was unbiased. Of course, it wasn&#8217;t&#8230; it was just about normal for a mainstream media expose. A lot of titillation factor while simultaneously showing the most disturbing point of view it could to show you how important such news programs are. There was a large focus on the work of <a href=\"http:\/\/www.maxhardcore.com\/\">Max Hardcore<\/a> which is admittedly a bit intense. Of course, as the story goes no woman could possibly enjoy being treated roughly during sex or using rough language right?<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.msmagazine.com\/ubb\/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=4;t=001004\">The Ms. Boards Hardcore , the documentary<\/a> &#8211; just one post at the moment so I figured we&#8217;d put it here.<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.lukeford.com\/stars\/male\/max_hardcore.html\">Luke Ford &#8211; Max Hardcore<\/a> &#8211; Luke Ford is an odd duck. He is a porn industry &#8216;insider&#8217; in some ways but has also been shown to have deeply mistaken or absent support for any facts he quotes. Take much of what he says with a big grain of salt and understand that he has an axe to grind. With that said, the article on Max is almost balanced and does give you some idea why Max is such a controversial character.<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.pbs.org\/wgbh\/pages\/frontline\/shows\/porn\/\">frontline american porn PBS<\/a> &#8211; this special is often referenced by those who are anti-porn. Though there are some serious questions about it&#8217;s objectivity and credibility it is along the same news-as-entertainment style of &#8216;Hardcore&#8217;. Frontline has done some good things in the past but they also suffer from a tendency to be overly dramatic. You can <a href=\"http:\/\/www.pbs.org\/wgbh\/pages\/frontline\/shows\/porn\/view\/\">watch the entire special from this link<\/a> online.<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.tinynibbles.com\/frontline.html\">tiny nibbles &#8211; Frontline &#8211; American Porn<\/a> &#8211; a review of the Frontline special mentioned above. Some of the points discussed begin to show the flaws in that broadcast.<\/p>\n<blockquote>\n<p><i>&#8220;Watching Kirk attempt to illustrate the human face of the porn industry by profiling directors and (briefly) actors was almost like going over an adolescent boy&#8217;s list of questions about porn. Virtually every stereotypical notion about the adult industry was catered to in segments that represent only the tiniest slices of the genre. Instead of digging beneath the surface of the mainstream porn market to interview the people there (and incidentally where the money&#8217;s really being moved around), Frontline focused on the fringes of extreme porn, depicting pornography as a horrid, hundred-faced hydra of exploitation. Considering our culture&#8217;s internal struggle to reconcile sexuality with ingrained Puritanical values, portraying porn in a shocking and lurid manner is like shooting fish in a barrel, and this material did exactly that.&#8221; &#8211; <a href=\"http:\/\/www.tinynibbles.com\/frontline.html\">full text<\/a><\/i><\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.salon.com\/sex\/feature\/2002\/02\/11\/frontline\/\">Salon.com Sex American Porn<\/a> &#8211; The folks at Salon had something to say about the show as well. Not as scathing as one might think &#8211; but definitely taking a shot across the bow.<\/p>\n<blockquote>\n<p><i>&#8220;American Porn&#8221; isn&#8217;t badly researched or preachy or one-sided. But good journalism can&#8217;t encourage society to lie about itself; it can&#8217;t take a mass cultural phenomenon and then act as if its audience isn&#8217;t part of that phenomenon. The gap between private desires and public behavior doesn&#8217;t bode well for free speech. Unless America is willing to admit to jerking off to Jenna, it may soon find itself sleeping with the enemy.&#8221; &#8211; <a href=\"http:\/\/www.salon.com\/sex\/feature\/2002\/02\/11\/frontline\/\">full text<\/a><\/i><\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.salon.com\/mwt\/feature\/2002\/06\/20\/lizzy_borden\/index.html\">Salon.com Life Porn provocateur<\/a> &#8211; Lizzy Borden features prominently in the Frontline special we have been looking at. In this Salon article she is interviewed and gets to talk a little bit to someone who isn&#8217;t trying to paint her as Satan. Her films are well, <a href=\"http:\/\/www.extremeassociates.com\/\">extreme<\/a> but that isn&#8217;t always a bad thing \ud83d\ude42<\/p>\n<blockquote>\n<p><i>&#8220;But in the privacy of her own office &#8212; a cramped cinderblock warehouse covered with posters of naked women and autographed Hulk Hogan photographs &#8212; she wears sweat pants and a Quiksilver T-shirt, with no visible makeup and her hair pulled back in a ponytail. Plus, the slippers.&#8221; &#8211; <a href=\"http:\/\/www.salon.com\/mwt\/feature\/2002\/06\/20\/lizzy_borden\/index.html\">full text<\/a><\/i><\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.extremeassociates.com\/\">Extreme Associates<\/a> &#8211; that&#8217;s the company Lizzy Borden is part of. It seems that as a response to the furor over the Frontline special the feds have made a play to try and draw a line in the sand prescribing the First Amendment. I am sure my more radical feminist readers will be thrilled&#8230; but the lawyers I know who work first amendment cases routinely say this won&#8217;t be much of a problem to defeat. <\/p>\n<blockquote>\n<p><i>&#8220;At approximately 9:10 AM Pacific Time Tuesday morning, roughly 47 uniformed federal marshals and postal inspectors from Pittsburgh and Philadelphia, Pennsylvania with assistance from the LAPD, served a search and seizure warrant for 4 Extreme Associates and 1 Armageddon Entertainment movie&nbsp; [ snip ] <\/i><\/p>\n<p><i>Starting today, we will be giving you periodic updates in the case of THE UNITED STATES vs EXTREME ASSOCIATES. The very same media that thrust us into the spotlight will now have their much anticipated main event. So make sure you stay tuned because we are just getting started. To the few in the industry who have supported us, and you know who you are, I thank you and appreciate it, even when my actions at times were completely retarded.&#8221;&nbsp; &#8211; <a href=\"http:\/\/www.extremeassociates.com\/mainpage.html\">full quote<\/a><\/i><\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<p>One thing that is amusing is that the five tapes the feds wanted to investigate are now <a href=\"http:\/\/www.extremeassociates.com\/federalfive.htm\">on sale as a special bundle<\/a> by the company. <\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<table cellSpacing=\"0\" cellPadding=\"1\" bgColor=\"#000000\" border=\"1\">\n<tbody>\n<tr>\n<td vAlign=\"center\" align=\"middle\"><a href=\"\/archives\/media\/B.ascx\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" height=\"272\" src=\"\/archives\/media\/B-thumb.jpg\" width=\"125\" border=\"0\"><\/a> <\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<tr>\n<td vAlign=\"center\" align=\"middle\" height=\"20\">1st amendment \ud83d\ude42<\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/tbody>\n<\/table>\n<p><b>The Anti-Porn Feminist View:<\/b><\/p>\n<blockquote>\n<p>In many ways some of these threads are the genesis of this post, simply because they raised the issue if the Frontline special and others. Upon looking into it a bit further, we find that it isn&#8217;t all as cut and dried as they might like. However, reading through the threads gives you a good view of the processes, (mis)information, fear and anger that drives the anti-porn movement.<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.msmagazine.com\/ubb\/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=4;t=001001;p=1\">The Ms. Boards Boyfriend and Porn<\/a> &#8211; a current thread on the topic that gives you a fairly good look at the anti-porn feminist party line. It&#8217;s all here and it&#8217;s pretty clear how quickly it all turns anti-male. To my female readers remember: if you think porn is hot, good or that women are capable of making the choice to be part of it you are a deluded tool of the patriarchy.<\/p>\n<blockquote>\n<p><i>&#8220;OH god does that idea annoy me! You don&#8217;t have to do something for other people in order to &#8216;express&#8217; something. And whose sexuality exactly? It&#8217;s taken me 22 years to begin to discover MY sexuality other than what ideals have been imposed on me via relentless sexualised images of women. I often suspect, though this is massively dismissive to those legions of women, they&#8217;re expressing cliched male heterosexuality more than their own.&#8221; &#8211; <a href=\"http:\/\/www.msmagazine.com\/ubb\/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=4;t=001001;p=5#000105\">quote in context<\/a><\/i><\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.msmagazine.com\/cgi-local\/ubb\/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=4;t=000953\">The Ms. Boards Activism Revisited (Note also about porn)<\/a> &#8211; a older thread about porn (long) that covers a fairly wide range of topics. Here you can get more understanding of the anti-porn feminist faction and their reasoning and ultimate goals. You must understand that they in the end draw little distinction ethically between penetrative porn that involves live women and anything they feel is objectifying of women. In extreme cases they feel that getting rid of hardcore porn would be pointless as long as <a href=\"http:\/\/www.maximonline.com\/\">Maxim<\/a> and the like existed. <\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.msmagazine.com\/ubb\/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=4;t=000848;p=1\">The Ms. Boards porn in the mainstream<\/a> &#8211; Some more of the discussion. Honestly it gets a little repetitive but sometimes a tidbit turns up. The same themes are here. <\/p>\n<ul>\n<li>Any image of a women they don&#8217;t liek is objectifying,\n<li>Anything objectifying is anti-woman and thus porn.\n<li>Any image of a woman that is attractive or sexy is threatening and thus must be attacked.\n<li>The very concept of &#8220;sexy&#8221; seems to me a male patriarchal construct.\n<li>Anyone who wishes to be sexy or attractive has been brainwashed by the patriarchy.\n<li>Etc. <\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<p><i>&#8220;It absolutely disgusts me. And great &#8212; summer is coming, which means the parade of 16 year olds in string bikinis and Playboy visors will start, as they travel up my street to the lake. I guess I&#8217;m just sick of it all.&#8221; &#8211; <a href=\"http:\/\/www.msmagazine.com\/ubb\/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=4;t=000848;p=1#000003\">quote in context<\/a><\/i><\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<p>Well, that covers the porn edition for this weekend. Enjoy!<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>hot stuff I&#8217;ve been meaning to post about pornography here for a while, but it looks like I&#8217;ll be busy for the next week so I am going to simply frame the debate and leave you with some resources. There is a lot of material here to present, and if you want to follow along [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":3,"featured_media":53157,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"aside","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[278],"tags":[],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"http:\/\/legacyiamsenseiken.local\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/51020"}],"collection":[{"href":"http:\/\/legacyiamsenseiken.local\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"http:\/\/legacyiamsenseiken.local\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"http:\/\/legacyiamsenseiken.local\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/3"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"http:\/\/legacyiamsenseiken.local\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=51020"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"http:\/\/legacyiamsenseiken.local\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/51020\/revisions"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"http:\/\/legacyiamsenseiken.local\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/53157"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"http:\/\/legacyiamsenseiken.local\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=51020"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"http:\/\/legacyiamsenseiken.local\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=51020"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"http:\/\/legacyiamsenseiken.local\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=51020"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}